When will the Beta be done and the Firmware released? @trampa
Soon, but now Benjamin needs to get the feedback and get everything sorted. Itās more about the structure, so that contributions can be made in a structured way. Otherwise it will get a bit messy. So better nail things now than start in a rush and mess things up. As stated before, itās a matter of manpower, which will be resolved once stable funding is guaranteed. We are talking about a restart of the entire Project.
Frank
It seems to me that anything that we formerly called a VESC we should now just call an ESC8. This new moniker starts with āESCā (which it is) and the ā8ā basically makes it an ESC designed for electric sk8boards. This makes it unique and differentiates it from the ESCās used in RC cars, planes, etc. Weād all know that physically itās a VESC and give Vedder the credit he is due under the terms of the licensing agreement.
Enertion could have an ESC8-X Series, Torque could have an ESC8-T Series, Carvon could have an ESC8-C Series, and we (Jet Skateboards) could have an ESC8-J Series of Electronic Speed Controllers. We could add numbers and/or letters for different versions/generations such as a ESC8-J4.12 or ESC8-J6. Alternatively we could put the brand before it and the version number after it such as a Jet ESC8-v4.12 or Jet ESC8-V6 or Jet ESC8.4.12
Thatās my two cents. Nobody steal my ESC8-J name!
4 Likes
Sorry for off-topic. @ChrisChaput: are you with Jet Skateboards? Then where the hell are all Spud and Potato decks? We need more!
1 Like
Controllers based on the VESC-Project, are in most cases universal for all sorts of equipment, so naming it ESK8 whatever means cutting off all the other potential markets. Everyone using the same brand is not very wise, because in the end you want to build up a reputation, linked to your own brand. That is in the very interest of every brand. Customers buy from a certain source because they trust that source.
There is a logo and partner program in place. This program can be used for identifying compatibility and showing project support. Customers will see who is supportive and they will see that 100% compatibility with the VESC-Software solutions is guaranteed. This does not mean the device is of a certain quality, because quality is something the individual brand has to stand in for.
The best way forward is a rebranding, fair use of the trademark and joining the official partner program to support Benjamin, and show the compatibility. A bit of invest into R&D is very wise, since more equipment and software can be developed, which makes more equipment available, which means the customer has access to more and better hardware/software and the manufacturer and vendor has more to offer and will in consequence have better sales. Most companies invest quite a bit into R&D, why would you want your R&D source to dry out, if you base your sales on the projects achievements? In my eyes itās stupid to cut that corner.
Starting a campaign to rename or confuse the origin of the technology and software is purely an attempt to hide away the fact that the technology is coming from a certain source that put all the effort in to make it available in the first place.
Now everyone has the chance to join in and support the project and in return being granted huge benefits. In the end itās in the customers hands, since he will make the decision to purchase from a vendor/manufacturer who is project-supportive or not. This is only possible if a transparent system is in place, allowing the customers to clearly identify project supporters. Since this transparency will be given very soon, there is no reason to be afraid of anything. The new, official partner program branding will establish itself in no time.
Frank
. Changed my mind.
1 Like
I think re-branding should only happen once a specific change has been made to the original open source design. Could get a little confusing for the uninitiated otherwise.
ESC8 sounds like a good name for a fork in the OS design specific to electric skate. Or V-ESC8?
1 Like
@chacka, i think your redesign from 4.12 with direct FetĀ“s was a good way for all the customer they want a good 4.12 that was working and donĀ“t want pay over 350$ fore one Vā¦ We have redesigned the 4.12 too and we have used some parts from your design. And i must say ist very good working. You give the community your knowledge continue and try it making better. And you will not get rich by it. But it is and remains a community that is strong But not stupid. I wish you for your work And toil also thanks get
5 Likes
Donāt forget about @onloop and especially @Blasto for their contribution with the VESC-X. Nice to be able control the heat with the Direct-FETs isnāt it!
3 Likes
MBS!!! Say it with me. MBS Mountainboards. They invented Mountainboards.
2 Likes
I think the original design for a direct FET upgrade was the VESC 5, which never happened because Benjamin wanted to bite the bullet and rewrite the software, which ended in VESC SIX and VESC-Tool. Anyway, its good to see different DF designs because this means more choice for the customer.
Frank
Yes, Jet Skateboards, Abec 11 Wheels, Biltin Bearings, Attack, Liquid and Fyre Trucks. Our wood shop ran into trouble and got way behind schedule because when they received a huge wood order, NONE of the plies delivered were cross plies. You canāt make a deck that doesnāt warp without cross. They got their cross recently and are in the process of making your favorite Potatoes, Vulcans, KillShots, etc.
Sorry for the delays ā¦ I hate not having what you want when you need it ;(
2 Likes
wow - big fan. Now whereās all my flywheels? Quit selling them all to evolve already ! I jumped on the carvon kickstarter and am really stoked to see you guys working together. Canāt wait for my Carvon V3/Liquid trucks !
Now Iām confused. Youāre saying what NOT to call it, but youāre not suggesting what we SHOULD call. Itās been called a VESC for so long now that everyone in the electric skateboard market now has the problem of trying to figure out what to call it that isnāt āVESCā. And yes, everyone using it in other markets is screwed as well. Iām just trying to come up with a name that āweā (meaning the skateboard community) can live with. We didnāt create this problem for ourselves, the rug was pulled out from under us and now weāre scrambling to accommodate Vedder and apparently Trampa.
This doesnāt have to be a big deal, but we DO need a name. It sucks because obviously āVESCā is the name that everyone knows, understands, and has been using since day one.
What do you suggest that we use now that VESC is off the table?
1 Like
Do you really think that the person who decided that we are not allowed to use the name VESC anymore should decide how it should be named ??
Iām not saying WHO should decide, Iām asking WHAT he suggests. I donāt want a name such as āThe artist formerly known as Princeā when everyone wants to call him Prince. Suddenly saying, āHey, you canāt use that name anymoreā is problematic at best, and a really bad marketing decision that will bite people in the ass at worst. Seriously, what the hell are people supposed to call a Vedder designed/inspired ESC that everyone has just called a VESC for years? VESC is the best name for any and all such ESCs, regardless of whether or not they are open-source or not. Personally I think that Benjamin should have his trademark but never enforce it unless and until he wants to shut down every open-source version. Trampa can have the only one called a VESC6 and everyone would know that theirās is different than other VESCs, but forcing others to call their VESCs something other than VESC is just lame.
A rose by any other name ā¦
2 Likes
You can call a old Vesc still Vesc and the new ones too. Or DRVCooker, Coollittlespeedbox or whatever you want. New Vesc will have new names, like Enertions Vesc is now a Focbox.
You just canĀ“t call it a Vesc anymore written on a product or as a vendor.
1 Like
Hi @ChrisChaput, If you look into this world, you will see that many OS-Projects exist, despite the fact that the projects are having TMs. Third party hardware simply uses different names - still everyone knows its compatible.
How do you call a Arduino Clone or Compatible device?
What would you suggest the VESC-Project should use as Trademark? Benjamin called his project VESC from day one, so its probably the TM he should own.
@akira[quote=āakira, post:400, topic:23017, full:trueā] Do you really think that the person who decided that we are not allowed to use the name VESC anymore should decide how it should be named ?? [/quote]
Am I the person who decided that the community is not allowed to use the name VESC any more? The person who registered the TM is Benjamin BTW and he did that for a very good reason. VESC links back to his good name, because he is the guy behind the project. The community (users) can use the name VESC as much as it likes. The Arduino community probably uses the Arduino TM frequently although the project does business on selling its own hardware and protects its TM, just like any other OS-Project does.
Frank
vesc is too hard to say anyway and VEC is what I always called it. Hoping it catches.
Itās a long thread and sorry if Iām redoing it but Is every vendor going to come up with their own name for a variation of the 4 now?
Cant someone pretty much make the 6 and just call it whatever they want other than the vesc? Looking forward to that! $400 for the 6 is going too far and thereās still a huge amount of room for other vendors it seems.
Please someone make a VEC 4 that is reliable on FOC! I donāt need 50 amps continuous by a long shot.
Is the unreliability of FOC due to high erpm mainly?
Once again youāve completely avoided the question of what everyone is supposed to call their VESC now.
Iāll answer your question. Benjamin should call his trademarked VESC-Project a VESC. Everyone would know what it is and he could add numbers and letters and symbols to it over time to make his unique. What Iām saying is that everyone should also be allowed to call theirs a VESC as well. Thereās no (good) reason why not to. Benjamin obviously has the right to call it a VESC and no one would ever suggest that he not.
The time to enforce a Trademark is BEFORE the universe has accepted, adopted, and used a name in commerce for years. Itās really too late to expect everyone NOT to use the only name thatās ever been used to describe an object.
1 Like