Vedder's VESC 6.0

@karma - i’ve not yet. I will still need to avoid >60k ERPM on the 4.xx hw. I won’t run 12s given 192kv - BLDC or FOC. I might go up to 12s on my guest board as it’s only 149kv… but being for guests i’m trying to keep it safe/slow’ish - so most of the time will probably only run 6 or 8s.

I have another couple in process and building some 18650 packs, so something will get at least 10s if not 12s and likely FOC.

I run 230kv @ 10s which is the same theoretical eRPM as 190kv @ 12s with no issues. Real motor kv’s tend to be about 10kv lower than advertised, and after you factor in various inefficiencies such as voltage sag, you get an eRPM approximately 5k lower than calculated.

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The FOCBOX and our Ollin ESC are both based on v4.12 with the same or higher constant current capability of the vesc6. If you are using motors outside the scope of eboarding you will probably want the 3rd current shunt resistor the vesc6 offers.

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I’ve seen that as well. I’ve also found that “bleeding edge” of the VESC is rarely a good idea for long term reliability. I have 4.7 hw that has been going strong for 2+ years now… I’ve found being moderate in your settings and sticking to BLDC is the best way to keep it simple and reliable. I’ve got a couple Axle VESC’s with the improved BOM components which i’ll test FOC a bit more.

Axle, Ollin, or FOCBOX are the only VESC4’s I’d buy. Too many people cheap out on their VESC and complain when they break. Better to overspec, than to get the bare minimum and be surprised or inured when it breaks beyond that.

I’ll play around with FOC once I get my focboxes from the group buy.

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Thanks for the encouragement! I thought I’d read a lot on this forum, apparently I missed an entire section - did not know there was an ebike section for ES. I’ll check it out.

As it happens I’m making a scooter not a bike, as in a kick scooter. I intend to run initially off one hub motor at back. (ultimately, if time allows building the whole thing and having two wheel drive with a hub at both ends). Larger than most have at about 200mm external tyre diameter. Because the width puts the effective moment of inertia midway between a skateboard and a bike I thought I’d read lots here first and just liked the ‘lively’ nature of the discussions and the (mostly) fairly technical / knowledgeable responses. And as I said previously, the VSEC - specifically the 6 - looks like a very nice bit of electronics and far more interesting than the big(er) branded EV / ebike controllers.

And in case you’re wondering: the scooter solution because its for commuting and: I can’t skate, think folding bikes on UK trains should be punishable by death unless they fit in the overheads because of the vital standing room they use up, because whilst not legal on pavements I think at 8-10 mph at 7am even in london the rush is small enough to allow for safe mixing with pedestrians, and having commuted through central london on a sports bike for half a decade and fluking survival, I want to use my making obsessions to engineer myself some transport!

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Definitely check out ES. I’ve seen a few scooter builds (most w/ motor/gears not hubs), and they look perfect for your use. Might have some inspiration as you get closer to building.

Because i’m a bigger guy i would opt for a stealthy motor setup vs hubs (gearing helps with hills and keeps speeds down on high voltage), but know this will be covered on ES too.

Post a build here - most of the electronics will carry over and it’s much more active here for help and feedback.

The VESC Six seems ideal, but even a 4.12 VESC likely could do what you need without trouble. I’d look at a single setup until you need dual (motor or hubs) since it’s significantly more complex/costly to go dual vs single.

If you start a thread on ES, let us know and will follow either location!

GL!

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Sweet scoot. Will it chooch?

What does “with NRF” means?

Side note, is it just me or is the trampa website horrible? It feels really messy and it’s hard to get around. Like internet 1998 all over :smiley:

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Hahahaha sorry @trampa but this is true :joy: :joy: :joy: :joy: :joy: .

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NRF is a radio transceiver, integrated in VESC SIX. Due to difficult regulations (e.g. FCC), we do not ship them with NRF to countries outside the EU. Anyway, there is currently no NRF hand held radio controller available, so the NRF transceiver is only interesting for those , who can build a replacement PCB for the Nunckuck, according to the files provided by Benjamin Vedder on Git Hub.

Frank

Thanks for the explanation.

Actually a few days back I saw this nrf controller on taobao:

Maybe you want to check it out since it has some nice specs like 18650 cellholder and joystick. Plus it is just 6€. http://c.b1yt.com/h.mx6Yht?cv=HZJZ00TFzaF&sm=510bba

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The china NRF are a gamble. We didn’t have to much success with those devices.

Thx for the Info, Frank

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Apologies if the answer to the following is well established, but will cheaper 6.0’s be available later in the year from anyone, any plans?

Once the beta phase is done, the designer happy, no immediate tweaks required, the circuit designs released as open source (or whichever complicated variant), once that is all done and beta testers of the 6.0 all have 100km of trouble free FOC silently and smoothly logged ;), are there plans for anyone else to start making boards? I know there are a few people here making the old(er) design at more sensible prices, but the new one currently available at $350 is bit out of my league at the moment. Just wondering if it always will be.

N.B. not sure if anyone else thinks like this, but: while I’d struggle to accurately solder up the whole thing in under a year and for less than a $1000 (I’d break the fets 7 times each), all the tertiary bits I can do myself - things like the case, heat sinks, connectors. Also I understand the drive and market for a version which is tested on the production line (twice apparently) for the more financially endowed out there, but there would also be a market for those of us who would happily do the testing ourselves, risk having to send it back or debug (with a little help!) if that meant saving a couple of quid.

P.s. By the way - no implied rebukement of the price point or work done on the ones in production, I have no right or inclination to criticize, if anything they look great, I just wonder if cheaper versions are planned by anyone.

The thing about VESC 6.0, an aluminum heatsink is mandatory for cooling the DirectFET MOSFET. I assume 33% of $350 was in the cost of CNC machining an aluminum case for the VESC 6.0.

Chuttney.

Whatever the cost was for the aluminium heatsink,

A good chunk of money went to Trampa and Benjamin.

And I am GLAD it did, it well make the future of the VESC project much better.

Everyone should be happy about Benjamin getting rewarded !!!

one love, Benjamin.

Actually US customers don’t pay VAT! Its easy to deduct 20%. A twin set is 550pounds incl.VAT. So that equals 288$ per VESC. Price drops with volume. The casing and second PCB ad cost, just like the testing does. We want 100% happy customers. So we try not to cut any corners. In the end its still cheaper than dealing with cheap but fried HW.

Frank

I don’t think we can really complain about the price. You can get 4.12s for about 100$. @chaka’s version with a reputation to be superior in quality is already 165$, and his DFET version is 220$. The step to the 6s with 340$ is not that big. It is a brand new product, probably a big advance, includes NRF etc… Of course it’s expensive! I don’t think it was ever supposed to be a kind of low end or more affordable version. The different 4.12s versions are still around and fill that niche. And the new firmware/software will make those more awesome too! I’m sure as soon as the VESC6 goes open it won’t take long until this community releases new spins on the 6 with more affordable versions for different applications.

For most people it doesn’t make sense to buy the current design for dual setups with two NRFs and more power than most riders would ever want under their feet, or their batteries could handle… If you can’t wait, buy a 4.12 for now. That’s what I’m doing for my first build. My second build will be hopefully already be with the 6! Just be patient!:+1:

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Sorry, just to be clear, I wasn’t complaining about the price, not sure if I was misunderstood, or if the ensuing comments were just coincidentally unrelated remarks by people on how they think the price is fine. I did actually literally write “P.s. By the way - no implied rebukement of the price point…if anything they look great”

I really was just wondering if anyone else had any plans to make any no-frills versions based on the new designs, eventually, i.e. in many months. No lack of patience here.