That’s a great idea, and I suggest you starting a thread on it- we all haven’t had a solid debate on the best trucks for an eboard yet!
I’m just trying not to hijack this thread with something off topic like trucks 
Gotta love hijacking all them threads…
1 Like
the motors will kick out the data center between the wheels on the hanger by 17mm. Arsenal cast trucks come in 165 and 180 and Paris in 180 and 195 while almost all the other trucks come in 180 and 160. I use the Paris
I’ve a set of caliber, Arsenal cast, and the Paris. The motors fit fine on the Arsenal and I believe the Paris they were fine too, but the Paris had threads that were a bit shorter and needed to be cut with a handheld die.
For me the biggest question is how to get the trucks to stick on the axle as they’re either going to unscrew accelerating or braking depending on which side they are on. I forget the numbers now but loctite’s torque resistance in foot pounds exceeds the torque that these motors can theoretically put out. I did some tests and got roughly 35 foot pounds necessary to turn the same size threading and bolt with red loctite’s applied. (When it does give it doesn’t come free really but kinda oozes slowly). The motors might do 16…I forget the formula and need to look it up as someone broke it down based on kv and max power and other things. Or there’s probably a true number of foot pounds these motors are producing I could figure out based on my weight and acceleration speed. Maybe. So that sounds fine and the glue holds and that’s just with red loctite’s on the threads but, and I’ve been discouraged from this worry by others who are engineers, I was worried about the constant vibrations or stresses on the aluminum threading and thought it might break behind the glue. Aluminum stress cycles leading to cracks. But it’s a small space the axle has to move and the threads are deep I’m told and Marc is planning to set up his motors with just the loctite. I do feel comforted that the glue gives slowly, but I don’t like the idea of resting on the threads as he is going to do. I used j and b weld. But I don’t recommend that either as it is too thick to get good surface coverage and avoid any voids, and it is iron filled and not good for vibration and shock and not the best shear strength. I believe it will be fine but not ideal and a mess to use. There is a better glue that is very thin and double the shear strength used to insert golf club heads into shafts. You know they can’t have them flying off. I’m torn thinking really the easiest way for everyone whose getting these would be for me to do the glue job as otherwise people will use who knows what, and while that might be interesting to see what holds and doesn’t,not the safest. I’ll be having to get more money from people to ship these motors and after seeing what they want to do…hopefully I’ll end up buying them all trucks and doing the possible thread cutting and gluing. The one downside to the use of such a permenant bond is the big bearing on the inside is trapped. While it’s a nice NSK bearing with more than double either dynamic and static load bearing of a typical skate bearing, it might need to be maintained years down the road. I wont be riding in the rain even when I finally seal up my vescs to protect them as I don’t want the bearing in water. I am thinking when the fat bearing does eventually go dry I can remove the rotors with their rubber, and sink the hanger in a vat of oil and then stick it in my vacuum chamber. This is the cost for permenantly fixing the motors but it’s fine with me. the other bearing is replaceable and also stronger than a skate bearing in dynamic and static loads. You guys bought them and I hope you don’t feel this is a problem. If you ever wanted to ship me your hanger I could do it for you free. Clean it up and spray the windings with more enamel!
Meant to say the caliber were fine fit wise. The only issue is the thread length. Some are too short. Paris for example. Need a die to cut them further.
Not to abuse your generosity, if I send over my 180mm paris trucks you can modify them and install the hub motors?
Yes I can cut the threads further so the motors will screw all the way on and I can also permanently glue them if you want. The gluing…I recommend doing it permenantly as I say but three engineers I’ve talked to about it specifically think red loctite is fine.
Or get a 195 hanger and they are very close in wheel diameter. We’re talking 1 or 2 mm. With two 180 Paris it’s 14mm difference in wheel spacing. Not a big deal and really not important at all. Why people don’t ride differnet widths …as long as they fit
Some thing I did not take into consideration, I have shit roads in my area and my feet and knees get destroyed on a regular longboard with large soft 97mm wheels.And I have to locktight them anyway, so I am worried that the hub motors will suffer from road abuse and the windings or the copper coils in the motor will suffer as a result. I feel a belt setup allows you to switch motors and keeps the motor safe at the expense of belts and gears. The hub motor will have to be disassembled to repaired. Lastly what if the board goes over a curb and other rough terrian, how will the hub motors handle that?
TL;DR I am already invested in a belt setup that I like, know works well and have invested money into. But I like the idea of cheap hub motors $100 versus $80 for a motor and $120 for a mechanical kit even if the hub motors are more vulnerable.
I would have to recommend a ceramic bearing for this if you could get one. I have been very impressed by the way that ceramic bearings handle dust and dirt with absolutely no maintenance whatsoever.
San Francisco streets can be pretty crappy too. I’ve also had one of the motors run over by an suv and its in a video on endless sphere.
Motor maintenance…there are spaces for screens in the Windows of the motor to keep out debris but I haven’t put them in yet. The windings of a hub motor are probably about as likely to get damaged from rough road vibrations as with an off the side motor mount. If you’re worried about it I’ve heard of using thermally conductive epoxy. Especially with the low kv motors we use the windings are thinner and have more possibility to vibrate against each other possibly removing enamel and causing a short…although I haven’t heard of a case of this specifically happening it makes sense. The thermal epoxy also helps dissipate heat and you will have a higher power possible. The magnets should be fine as long as the screens are put in these motors.
The big bearing…either you run use red loctite and later wrench the motor off using a two pin spanner wrench or if it’s permanantly fixed on you service it after…awhile. I’ll look into the ceramic. As it is now and for this coming production it has 2 NSK bearings from Japan and they’re really good and much stronger than a skate bearing as I said but if less maintenance is needed with the same ability to take load with ceramic …and they aren’t crazy expensive…maybe go that route next time.
Are you going to protect your motors from any vibrations and shock, because right now that is a big thing that worries me. A satellite config vibrates the motor from a mount that is not in contact with the ground.
Based on my experience driving hub motors now for 6 month and way beyond 1000km I never experienced that to be a problem.
And a satellite config is also not really protected against shocks more, it’s just the thickness of the urethane. I can’t see a big difference.
if your motor is mounted to a skate truck it’s going to get road vibrations.
That applies to both hub motors and belt configurations.
On a belt config, it is true that the motor itself doesn’t touch the ground, but it’s still connected via a solid mount that doesn’t absorb many vibrations. It does have a whole wheel to stop vibrations, but that really doesn’t make a huge difference compared to the rubber on a hub motor.
I agree that vibrations are slightly more on a hub motor, but it isn’t by a significant enough amount to worry about it.
No matter what, all of our motors are connected to the ground with little to no protection from vibrations anyways.
The difference is a hub motor is supporting all of your weight. Vibrations and shock only compound that fact.
Satellite motors are completely isolated from that force. They only have to push our fat Asses.
1 Like
That’s what I wanted to say, the forces are different on hub motors.
But it’s doable - holding the two cylindrical planes permenantly within .5mm of each other, even with extreme vibration and shock. Pediglide is getting good life out of his motors I think, and he did add different bearings and other changes from the original design, which I think is also still going. My motors have only seen about 130miles so far. There are other hub motors out there that are surviving. Jason who runs endless-sphere made some long ago and someone on this site and ES made some with cored kegels. I wonder about the big name companies on Kickstarter…have they produced something that lasts or are they pushing back production while they come up with a solution. E-go seems an extreme example of a board that is constantly breaking and the seller is constantly sending warranty replacements.
Had a scare lastnight and felt and heard rubbing as I spun the wheels in my hands! Both! I’ve redloctited the ring on and wish I’d used something milder as I can’t get it off…but blasted inside with air and it’s good. Was thinking for a long time what could’ve collapsed.
This is what I want to make! Imagine the load on those bearings.
There are a number of additional forces on hub motors that satellite motors most likely never see.
@lever is using custom milled endbells that allow for the use of 608 bearings. Those bearings are proven to support weight as well as abuse such as stair gaps and drops. I’m not knocking anyone’s design, merely talking about the differences in force between designs.
A brushless out runner that is now a hub motor has the magnets spinning the urethane and the coils are also indirectly in contact with the ground and the gravitational forces is something that satellite configs are protected from and cause less stress.
1 Like
Pediglide/lever has a thread that’s too long to look for a picture of what he makes now. he’s further changed but I thought he was working with a long outrunner that happened to have a skirt/big bearing. You say he’s using a 608 bearing, which is a regular skate bearing. Does he use two of those now or still the original big motor bearing? And a machined bell? Thought it was the outrunner rotor. I remember he was changing things a lot.
i agree I think there’s more physical stress to a motor in a wheel. The magnets and glue have shown they can take it, and big bearings surely can, and so can the rubber. The stator’s windings…you can get enamel spray that’s intended for just such a purpose of adding a coating. I really like the idea. Even more I want to try thermally conductive epoxy. Some people say it will make things worse but I’ve heard from people first hand that it works. Not potting it all but just painting some on they did. I’d like to pot the windings in it though but heard that if you have an air bubble it will make things much worse. This doesn’t make sense to me
I think I heard once that he was using one of each if that makes sense.