Make him an offer he can’t refuse next time… Lol
@Arch you need to show that a substantial portion of your copyright has been infringed. Very hard thing to do. Nobody has a monopoly on the Moby Dick story.
@Arch Stop spending money on your lawyer my man, that conclusion is precisely accurate. Case closed.
@Mobutusan Frank’s just mad cause @Stewii is giving us a way to ESCape the Trampa (trap)
From my native languague (Spanish)…
Spanish ----------------------------------------------- English
trampa nf (ardid, engaño) -------------------------- trap n el enemigo nos tendió una trampa ---------------- the enemy set us a trap
https://www.wordreference.com/es/en/translation.asp?spen=Trampa
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@stewii you just got the best marketing campaign for free 
As it was stated earlier all Franks claims are bullshit. The thing is that he believes that people could confuse Vesc6 with ESCape. I think that it’s the opposite and people clearly see what is what and for what price.
I just hope that you’ll stick to that when you release you skateboard trucks that you mentioned. Can’t wait to see this innovation and I hope I won’t be confused by it’s look and how they work with dozens of other brands 
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I find it absolutely absurd that Frank is calling the VESC 6 his achievement. I wonder just how much input, if any, he gave to BV while developing the VESC 6. I imagine he felt like he won the lottery in getting BV to work with him and license this under Trampa’s IP. Unfortunately he got greedy and decided to charge an obscene amount for them, which is what caused these alternatives to come to market. If Tampa had just charged a reasonable amount I think it’s safe to say they’d have sold many more units and in the long run would have made a larger profit even. Since the opposite was done, they are directly responsible for the competitive market that’s been created for the 6th version of the VESC. As was said earlier, people aren’t confusing the ESCape for the VESC 6, but rather the other way around, and as a direct result of how Trampa is behaving. Trampa is going about this trying to threaten/intimidate the little guy, so to speak. Personally, I will make it a point to never purchase anything from Trampa, and hell if @stewii has to end up charging the same, or more, I’d still buy from him, just out of principle. Additionally, I think it’s pretty reckless to call the ESCape an exact copy. Anyone with eyes can tell that claim is BS!
In addition to the visual differences, it’s clearly stated in the first post, and the one above, that this unit doesn’t have the motion detection chip that VESC 6 does. That seems a pretty large thing to overlook if your going to say someone made an exact copy of your design.
We all drive cars and they all have 4 wheels, headlights and a passenger cabin. No one has a design on the concept itself and everyone can make cars but they are all designed differently. That is what design is about. Even pullovers look different, most of the featuring two sleeves and a body.
If you look at what @stiwii has done you will realise that “his” design is a straight 1:1 copy of ours. If you think that this is the only way to design a HW 6 based ESC, you are all on the wrong train. This would be like saying that all e-boards would need to look exactly the same since they all have a deck, 4 wheels, two trucks a drivetrain, motors and a battery tray. Funnily enough, a Raptor 2 looks different to a Boosted, a Trampa street carver or a Marble Board and Ollins Boards although they all share similar technology. If you would take of the logos it would be easy to identify the source. They all look different and are designed differently, just like a Mercedes looks different than a Toyota or GM car. My Lenovo Laptop also doesn’t look like a MacBook or an Acer although all 3 of them have a keyboard, a monitor and a hinge. They differ in all aspects beside the general concept of a laptop.
You guy all confuse design and technology. As I said before, a FOCBOX and a VESC SIX are prime examples of how a similar product can differ in design and are associated with different brands and levels of quality. A design covers the products appearance, not the technology involved.
Even if a product is minimalistic in design, like a tablet or smartphone, there are still enough options on the table to design it differently. This is why we have a variety of models to choose from, going into a shop. Again, if you think that all tablets need to look the same, you are limited in your imagination. There are substantial differences in between the different models.
Back in the 90ties everyone thought that a computer needs to be a square box from metal in alpha white, ideally with greenish logos applied. Then Apple made computers looking completely different. They were thinking outside the box.
I find it astonishing that you all want the same cake all the time. Wouldn’t it be better to have more choice in future? Even cakes look different although most are round and have a certain hight to diameter aspect ratio.
If you copy a design and then you figure out that your copy clashes with the original design, you should blame yourself, not the originator of the design.
As I said, get creative.
Frank
BTW: The concept of the housing and position of the connectors is my work, not Benjamin’s. He designed the PCB, I designed the housing and then we optimized both to work hand in hand. Even for the same PCB there are tons of options on the table to house it, differing from our design.
When I talk about design, I am talking about the finished product, not the PCB
I don’t see any issue in others making HW 6. I just see an issue if those devices are a 1:1 copy of our design. I also don’t get the point to make a fuss about a certain design that we use. Since it is quite simple to design your own device, being different enough to meet legal requirements, it is not hindering anyone to make HW 6 based ESCs.
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simply put, as long as someone put the work in rewiring the VESC 6.0 PCB for a different enclosure. it does not violate whatever trampa is claiming
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@trampa “Wouldn’t it be better to have more choice in the future”. Interesting you saying that, when you’re directly in opposition to us having more choice for a version 6 VESC…
Also acting like this is just a matter of the design of the ESCape, and not related to sales and profits is very clear to everyone. I would venture to say even if the design was completely different, you would still try and find a way to put a stop to more competition any way you could. Your motivations are not altruistic, or for the betterment of this hobby, it’s all about the money.
Hey Frank, you are just hurting yourself here. The design differences are obvious enough, not much to gain there. The Focbox is also a square, so is your design a copy of that, just with different HW? If you are scared, just compete on the market!! Thank you @stewii providing an alternative design and market segment for us!
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you do not need to say anything kids, just stop!
a registered design (in au, anyhow) is just lodged, no one approves it. you can claim what you like…
don’t mean it is worth squat!
ask @Arch
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Yeah, designing the enclosure, that’s got absolutely nothing to do with what the VESC 6 does, it’s a box to put the VESC in and works as a heat sink. As stated above, that’s really just too close to the FOCBOX… I think @onloop has a case against you for design infringement. Oh and deciding where the cables went… Well, I imagine that would go where BV put the connection point on the circuit board. That’s like baking a cake with your mom when your young and she let you crack a few eggs to go into the mix and you taking credit for the whole cake. Yeah, you helped. Did it make any difference or change what would have been created regardless of if you helped or not. NO!
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If a vesc six wasnt freaking 300£+shipping there wouldnt be a discussion. The market demands cheaper pricing. Enertion can do it. Some dude in his garage can do it. Your move @trampa or your out. Simple as that…
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Well Frank that is a hell of design that enclosure… As you probably know I’m making those enclosures for @stewii and I received from him first model and than we went through some small changes and than because of some CAM issues I had to redraw everything and guess what it never cross my mind to look at Vesc6 to do that job. Yes they are similar in some way but it’s a fucking box! If you made that you know damn well as I that this form factor is not because it’s beautiful design but because manufacturing optimization. I have a feeling that you simply want to force him to choose more expensive design to produce.
Yeh but on the other hand you could choose brands that are more similar in look than Vesc6 and ESCape.
As you said it’s all about those details. The color of pcb is different, the logo is different (nicer 
guess who design that 
) the box I believe is smaller in every measurement…
So I’m serious asking you this right now. Please direct me to papers and rights that you have obtained regarding Vesc6 design that we could all know what to avoid in future!
And what about this?
Is it also confusing for your customers?
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Implying that your customers would be confused and wouldn’t know which is which really says a lot about how smart you must think your customers are… I think the real issue is that if a customer sees two products that do the same thing and one of them is double the price, but it doesn’t do a single thing more than the other, well… I think you can figure the rest out.
See, I don’t see an issue in others making HW 6.
Copying a design 1:1 is not O.K. if you ask me. If you are talking about choice, that doesn’t mean choice of the very same design. Sounds to me like someone saying: I wan’t the choice between the original and the 1:1 knockoff A,B,C,D. You should rather demand the choice between Product A B C D, all having their own USPs. That is real choice and helps you to get what you want and helps that a variety of different products enter the market. This drives innovation and is good for the customer. Not only will you have choice between price tags, but also between different models. Most products I know of come in all sorts of shapes, colours, material and dimensions. Seams like some guys here rather prefer a monotone product world. Quite Funny…
If you want to buy a cheaper product, fine! It is up to you to judge the quality and product value. And it is up to the vendor to prove his product to be competitive. If you come up with a 1:1 copy it is not in your favour anyway. You would base your business on the basis of giving customers the impression that they can get the very same thing for a different (smaller) price tag. This means you try to take advantage of the efforts someone else put into creating and marketing a product. This is the exact reason why the EU legislation puts designers in a better position to fight for their original designs. A design stands for a certain level of quality and trust into a brand.
It is up to the vendor to decide how close he dares to adopt an original design. I informed about facts, so he can make his decision in full knowledge and now he can get himself informed about the legal situation inside the EU before investing into a pile of stock that might be conflicting with our product design.
Frank
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To be frank @trampa, I don’t think anyone cares about the Trampa brand or design but rather the open source technology of the vesc6. I think you should look into minimizing costs of your excellent product instead to remain competitive.
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One thing I am finding unusual is that it seems @trampa is most concerned with how the enclosure and the PCB look, but neither of these are the ESCape, that’s the circuit board inside, which I haven’t seen you write about at all, just the three items combined. So what if @stewii just sold the ESCape, and then separately we bought the enclosure and PCB from two other sources? Not one of those things on its own violates any patent. Incidentally enough, @stewii offers to sell just the circuit board ESC, or you can buy it with an enclosure, which someone else makes, as well as the PCB. Or you can have a DIY kit and build the entire thing yourself. I think the fact that all these parts are not made just by @stewii, and individually each part violates nothing, so I think that further makes this product less like the VESC 6, since aside from the complete product, I have no idea what it looks like inside, and the insides are the ESC, not the case and cover.
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That is because he has no rights to VESC himself. He can only extort certain behavior on @stewii and community.
Frank, please read this link first:
Then tell us what you really legally want.
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If you ask me: I want people to use their brains and create something unique and new. As said before:E.g. Making use of Teslas OS patents doesn’t mean you should copy their car design. Technology and DESIGN are two different things.
Frank
Then I can only be really sorry for your bad business decision of investing in open source project while not properly understanding that it’s near impossible to lock it.
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